Controverted PointAsañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko hotīti? Theravādin:But you imply that if I accidentally take away life, I am a murderer,andsimilarly as to the other four wicked deeds forbidden by moralitythat if I accidentally take what is not given, I am a thief … if I utter untruths unintentionally, I am a liar. You deny. Yet you wish to make exceptionsto the relative innocence of such actsin just those five serious cases … .Āmantā. similarly as to the other four wicked deeds forbidden by moralityAsañcicca pāṇaṁ hantvā pāṇātipātī hotīti? to the relative innocence of such actsNa hevaṁ vattabbe …pe… Can you cite me a Sutta judging unintentional crime like that which says:asañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko hotīti? “He that intentionally takes his mother's life incurs immediate retribution”?Āmantā. You cannot. Neither can you maintain your proposition.Asañcicca adinnaṁ ādiyitvā …pe… Uttarāpathaka:But does not the fact remain that the mother's life is taken? Surely then the unintentional slayer also incurs immediate retribution.Similarly, too, doesone who unintentionally kills father or Arahant, or sheds a Buddha's blood, incur a like doom.musā bhaṇitvā musāvādī hotīti? Uttarāpathaka:Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe….

Theravādin:Now as to the fifth of such crimes: do you imply that all schismatics incur such a doom? You deny. But think again! You now assent. But does a schismatic who is conscious of right incur it? You deny. But think again! You now assent. But was it not said by the Exalted One:Asañcicca pāṇaṁ hantvā pāṇātipātī na hotīti? Now as to the fifth of such crimesĀmantā. “There is a kind of schismatic, Upāli, who incurs disaster, purgatory, misery for an æon on, who is incurable; there is a kind of schismatic, Upāli, who does not incur such a doom, who is not incurable”?Asañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko na hotīti? Hence it is not right to say that a schismatic who is conscious ofstating what isright incurs such a doom.Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe… stating what isasañcicca adinnaṁ ādiyitvā …pe… Uttarāpathaka:But was it not said by the Exalted One:musā bhaṇitvā musāvādī na hotīti? Uttarāpathaka:Āmantā. “He who breaks up the Orderis doomed to remain for an æon onin states of suffering and woe?“He who delights in party strife,and adheres not to the Dhamma,is cut off from Arahantship.Having broken up the Order when it was at peace,he must be cooked for an æon on in purgatory”?Asañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko na hotīti? “He who breaks up the Orderis doomed to remain for an æon onin states of suffering and woe?Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe….

“He who delights in party strife,and adheres not to the Dhamma,is cut off from Arahantship.Having broken up the Order when it was at peace,he must be cooked for an æon on in purgatory”?Asañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko hotīti? Hence surely a schismatic incurs retribution immediately after death.Āmantā. Shwe Zan Aung“Asañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko hotī”ti—This SuttaCentral edition was prepared byManfred WierichandVen. Vimalaand proofread byJosephine Tobin. Some changes were introduced:attheva suttantoti? Manfred WierichNatthi. Ven. Vimala“Sañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko hotī”ti—Josephine Tobinattheva suttantoti? Abbreviations, i.e., those of cited works and the participants in the controversies, were expanded.Cross-references were linked.Some typographic changes were introduced, among others, i.e.: the phonetic symbol “ŋ” was changed to the Pāli diacritical letter “ṃ”, “ô” to “o”, single quotes to double quotes, and “:—” to “:”.Letter-spacing with fixed spaces was replaced with bold font.The corrigenda were merged into the text. Some could not be resolved, though.Āmantā. Abbreviations, i.e., those of cited works and the participants in the controversies, were expanded.Hañci “sañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko hotī”ti—Cross-references were linked.attheva suttanto, no ca vata re vattabbe—Some typographic changes were introduced, among others, i.e.: the phonetic symbol “ŋ” was changed to the Pāli diacritical letter “ṃ”, “ô” to “o”, single quotes to double quotes, and “:—” to “:”.“asañcicca mātaraṁ jīvitā voropetvā ānantariko hotī”ti.

Letter-spacing with fixed spaces was replaced with bold font.Na vattabbaṁ—The corrigenda were merged into the text. Some could not be resolved, though.“mātughātako ānantariko”ti? This electronic version is published under the terms of the Creative Commons Attribution Non-Commercial 3.0 licence (CC BY-NC 3.0) as found here:http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/3.0/Āmantā. All copyright is owned by the Pali Text Society. See also the statement under http://www.palitext.com/ → Publications → Copyright Announcement. For non-commercial use only.Nanu mātā jīvitā voropitāti? Āmantā. Hañci mātā jīvitā voropitā, tena vata re vattabbe—“mātughātako ānantariko”ti.

Na vattabbaṁ—“pitughātako ānantariko”ti? Āmantā. Nanu pitā jīvitā voropitoti? Āmantā. Hañci pitā jīvitā voropito, tena vata re vattabbe—“pitughātako ānantariko”ti.

Na vattabbaṁ—“arahantaghātako ānantariko”ti? Āmantā. Nanu arahā jīvitā voropitoti? Āmantā. Hañci arahā jīvitā voropito, tena vata re vattabbe—“arahantaghātako ānantariko”ti.

Na vattabbaṁ—“ruhiruppādako ānantariko”ti? Āmantā. Nanu tathāgatassa lohitaṁ uppāditanti? Āmantā. Hañci tathāgatassa lohitaṁ uppāditaṁ, tena vata re vattabbe—“ruhiruppādako ānantariko”ti.

Saṅghabhedako ānantarikoti? Āmantā. Sabbe saṅghabhedakā ānantarikāti? Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe… sabbe saṅghabhedakā ānantarikāti? Āmantā. Dhammasaññī saṅghabhedako ānantarikoti? Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe….

Dhammasaññī saṅghabhedako ānantarikoti? Āmantā. Nanu vuttaṁ bhagavatā—“atthupāli, saṅghabhedako āpāyiko nerayiko kappaṭṭho atekiccho; atthupāli, saṅghabhedako na āpāyiko na nerayiko na kappaṭṭho na atekiccho”ti. Attheva suttantoti? Āmantā. Tena hi na vattabbaṁ—“dhammasaññī saṅghabhedako ānantariko”ti.

Na vattabbaṁ—“dhammasaññī saṅghabhedako ānantariko”ti? Āmantā. Nanu vuttaṁ bhagavatā—

“Āpāyiko nerayiko, Kappaṭṭho saṅghabhedako; Vaggarato adhammaṭṭho, Yogakkhemā padhaṁsati; Saṅghaṁ samaggaṁ bhetvāna, Kappaṁ nirayamhi paccatī”ti.

Attheva suttantoti? Āmantā. Tena hi saṅghabhedako ānantarikoti.

Asañciccakathā niṭṭhitā.