Controverted PointSekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthīti? Theravādin:Then you imply that the learner knows, sees the ideas of the adept, lives in the attainment of having seen, known, realized them, lives in personal contact therewith. If not—and you do deny this—then you cannot maintain your proposition.Āmantā. We grant of course that the adept knows, sees the ideas of the adept, lives in the attainment … and so on.But, as you have admitted, you cannot impute this knowledge to the learner.Sekho asekhaṁ dhammaṁ jānāti passati, diṭṭhaṁ viditaṁ sacchikataṁ upasampajja viharati, kāyena phusitvā viharatīti? Your position then is, that you credit the learner with the insight of an adept, yet you deny that the learner knows, sees the ideas of the adept, etc. But, the adept having also of course the insight of the adept, if he be as to insight on a level only with the learner, you must add of the adept also that he knows not, sees not the ideas of the adept, does not live in the attainment of having seen, known, realized them, does not live in personal contact therewith. Which is absurd, as you by your denial admit.Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe… You are ready to deny that a person in a lower Stage of the Path has the insight as yet of the next higher Stage, or that one who is adopted has yet the insight of even the First Stage. How then can you ascribe the insight of those who have finally attained to those who as yet have not?nanu sekho asekhaṁ dhammaṁ na jānāti na passati, adiṭṭhaṁ aviditaṁ asacchikataṁ na upasampajja viharati, na kāyena phusitvā viharatīti? Uttarāpathaka:Ifmy proposition is wrong, then how is it that a learner, as Ānanda was, knew the sublimity of the Exalted One, or of the Elder Sāriputta, or of the Elder Moggallāna the Great?Āmantā. Uttarāpathaka:Hañci sekho asekhaṁ dhammaṁ na jānāti na passati, adiṭṭhaṁ aviditaṁ asacchikataṁ na upasampajja viharati, na kāyena phusitvā viharati, no ca vata re vattabbe—Shwe Zan Aung“sekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthī”ti.

This SuttaCentral edition was prepared byManfred WierichandVen. Vimalaand proofread byJosephine Tobin. Some changes were introduced:Asekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthi, asekho asekhaṁ dhammaṁ jānāti passati, diṭṭhaṁ viditaṁ sacchikataṁ upasampajja viharati, kāyena phusitvā viharatīti? Manfred WierichĀmantā. Ven. VimalaSekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthi, sekho asekhaṁ dhammaṁ jānāti passati, diṭṭhaṁ viditaṁ sacchikataṁ upasampajja viharati, kāyena phusitvā viharatīti? Josephine TobinNa hevaṁ vattabbe …pe….

Abbreviations, i.e., those of cited works and the participants in the controversies, were expanded.Cross-references were linked.Some typographic changes were introduced, among others, i.e.: the phonetic symbol “ŋ” was changed to the Pāli diacritical letter “ṃ”, “ô” to “o”, single quotes to double quotes, and “:—” to “:”.Letter-spacing with fixed spaces was replaced with bold font.The corrigenda were merged into the text. Some could not be resolved, though.Sekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthi, sekho asekhaṁ dhammaṁ na jānāti na passati, adiṭṭhaṁ aviditaṁ asacchikataṁ na upasampajja viharati, na kāyena phusitvā viharatīti? Abbreviations, i.e., those of cited works and the participants in the controversies, were expanded.Āmantā. Cross-references were linked.Asekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthi, asekho asekhaṁ dhammaṁ na jānāti na passati, adiṭṭhaṁ aviditaṁ asacchikataṁ na upasampajja viharati, na kāyena phusitvā viharatīti? Some typographic changes were introduced, among others, i.e.: the phonetic symbol “ŋ” was changed to the Pāli diacritical letter “ṃ”, “ô” to “o”, single quotes to double quotes, and “:—” to “:”.Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe….

Letter-spacing with fixed spaces was replaced with bold font.Sekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthīti? The corrigenda were merged into the text. Some could not be resolved, though.Āmantā. This electronic version is published under the terms of the Creative Commons Attribution Non-Commercial 3.0 licence (CC BY-NC 3.0) as found here:http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/3.0/Gotrabhuno puggalassa sotāpattimagge ñāṇaṁ atthīti? All copyright is owned by the Pali Text Society. See also the statement under http://www.palitext.com/ → Publications → Copyright Announcement. For non-commercial use only.Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe… sotāpattiphalasacchikiriyāya paṭipannassa puggalassa sotāpattiphale ñāṇaṁ atthīti? Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe… sakadāgāmiphala … anāgāmiphala … arahattasacchikiriyāya paṭipannassa puggalassa arahatte ñāṇaṁ atthīti? Na hevaṁ vattabbe …pe….

Na vattabbaṁ—“sekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthī”ti? Āmantā. Nanu āyasmā ānando sekho—“bhagavā uḷāro”ti jānāti, “sāriputto thero, mahāmoggallāno thero uḷāro”ti jānātīti? Āmantā. Hañci āyasmā ānando sekho—“bhagavā uḷāro”ti jānāti, “sāriputto thero, mahāmoggallāno thero uḷāro”ti jānāti, tena vata re vattabbe—“sekhassa asekhaṁ ñāṇaṁ atthī”ti.

Asekhañāṇakathā niṭṭhitā.